Bt Builder

[dulsi]

Not the item list. The 13 item TYPES. Basically it would be like this:

Code: Select all

<itemType>
<Type>Boots</Type>
<hitBonus>1</hitBonus>
<ACBonus>0</ACBonus>
</itemType>

The Bonus Elements are just booleans that activate set bonuses. (Only weapons get hit bonuses, which I don't like.)

What? I've been wondering what you wanted for item types. You misunderstand how the current system works. If an item has a hit or AC bonus and you equip it, the bonus is applied. It doesn't matter if it is a weapon or boot or miscellaneous. I dislike this a little because a hit bonus from a sword applies to a bow and vies-versa.

That's not to say defining new types is not useful but I wouldn't implement the flags you have. If you don't want boots to have an AC bonus, never give an AC bonus to boots.

I hate that I don't know how many arrows a character has left and what not.

I assume this is more for other item types. Arrows should display the number of them.

[Methuselas]

What? I've been wondering what you wanted for item types. You misunderstand how the current system works. If an item has a hit or AC bonus and you equip it, the bonus is applied. It doesn't matter if it is a weapon or boot or miscellaneous. I dislike this a little because a hit bonus from a sword applies to a bow and vies-versa.

That's not to say defining new types is not useful but I wouldn't implement the flags you have. If you don't want boots to have an AC bonus, never give an AC bonus to boots.

I was assuming that you coded it like how BTCS was, in that only weapons had hit and damage bonuses. I don't like stacked bonuses either, especially for weapons. A weapon's bonus should only apply to it's use, but if you had an Amulet or what not that added a +1 bonus, it should affect all hit rolls.

As for the defining new types, that is what I want and to be able to define, on my own in an external xml file. Right now, if I want an Amulet, it's either a Miscellaneous Item or an Instrument. If I want Boots, it's an Instrument or it's a Miscellaneous item. If you want both, then one has to be either one of the item or both the same item type. That means a Bard would lose either his/her Instrument or if both the Amulet and Boots are Miscellaneous items, couldn't equip one of the two items.

I assume this is more for other item types. Arrows should display the number of them.

Yeah, some items should display charges, some shouldn't. It should be up to the builder to decide, no?

[dulsi]

I was assuming that you coded it like how BTCS was, in that only weapons had hit and damage bonuses. I don't like stacked bonuses either, especially for weapons. A weapon's bonus should only apply to it's use, but if you had an Amulet or what not that added a +1 bonus, it should affect all hit rolls.

Oops. I don't always look too closely at the BTCS documentation. I'm still going to keep the ability for all items to effect to hit bonus but I really need to fix it so that weapon bonuses only apply for that weapon.

New release is out. It doesn't have the item type list you requested. The file size has grown greatly with the new images. Something might need to do something about that. Switched windows back to SDL1 for the time being. Implemented Scry Sight as found in original Bard's Tale games. Right now it doesn't work as expected for a tower. Some small changed to the Sample 2 game.

For pocketchip, I've been playing around with a different display. I made the display wider. The image window takes up most of that to display the 228x176 images. The character status information is move to only beneath the text window. I lose max hit points, max spell points, and class. Instead I add green color to indicate you are at max. Black for below max but above half. Red for half or below. Right now it displays poison, stoned, death, etc. badly. It writes the text over the character's name but that makes it unreadable as the letters mix together. I was icons would be easier to understand.

[Methuselas]

Oops. I don't always look too closely at the BTCS documentation. I'm still going to keep the ability for all items to effect to hit bonus but I really need to fix it so that weapon bonuses only apply for that weapon.

Yeah, this is one of those things that I wasn't clear on, so when I was working on the docs, I had to go with what I knew, which was BTCS.

New release is out. It doesn't have the item type list you requested. The file size has grown greatly with the new images. Something might need to do something about that. Switched windows back to SDL1 for the time being. Implemented Scry Sight as found in original Bard's Tale games. Right now it doesn't work as expected for a tower. Some small changed to the Sample 2 game.

I knew this was going to be a problem a while ago, which was why I was wanting to renumber all the image files ( I wanted to trim down the number of images to around 100, not including the user defined). Originally, since they were just all static images, I just found images I liked, asked the artist if I could use them for a non-profit game and ran with it. PNGs are big files to begin with and MNGs even larger. I tried dithering the images, by adding an extra step and converting them to Gif first, but the savings was kilobytes, when I needed megabytes. My module is over a gig in size and that's mostly (about 85-90%) from animations.

As an aside, I keep all the image renders I've done and since it's a frame by frame thing, I can just pull an image out to save as a slot and we can make animations as separate download. I would say you could use the 7zip format to decrease the filesize of the archive, but I'm not sure that all platforms supported have the 7zip archiver.

For pocketchip, I've been playing around with a different display. I made the display wider. The image window takes up most of that to display the 228x176 images. The character status information is move to only beneath the text window. I lose max hit points, max spell points, and class. Instead I add green color to indicate you are at max. Black for below max but above half. Red for half or below. Right now it displays poison, stoned, death, etc. badly. It writes the text over the character's name but that makes it unreadable as the letters mix together. I was icons would be easier to understand.

Try this out in the linux version and just look at the first page of the Status Display. I followed the BT III format and you may want to use this as a basis for the Pocketchip. I have name, level and class taking up two lines (or in my case Name, Level, Alignment and Class). It may give you an idea for space in the Pocketchip edition.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BwpB_ ... 3JYTXhDd1U

I like the color coordination. Wish we had it for the PC builds. If you want, make a template icon to use for Death, Poison, Stone, etc and give me the pixel size. I can come up with some simple icons to use, instead of text. Poison a green droplet, Death a skull or tombstone, etc. As for the game screens, if that's a direct screenshot of the game screen, I can use that as a template to make a Mainscreen.png for the Pocketchip Edition. If you get me a screen of the Level Editor, I can do one for that, as well.

I won't be releasing any new images for a while. School just started again for me and Kiddo and I've been working on making facial animation sets for older Daz models in iClone. Evidently, it's become a popular thread, so I've been focusing my attentions on that, as I have not only user support but support from Real Illusion, as well.

[EDIT] - I really dig this layout, Dulsi. Is it PC-compatible?

[dulsi]

I really dig this layout, Dulsi. Is it PC-compatible?

Pocketchip is using the same code. PC has all the capabilities to do this as well. The only problem with it at the moment is that the image window is now 224x176 not 112x88. To make it work, I copy all the slot and tileset files from 640x400 directory and put them in the base image folder. I've been considering moving things around so this works without having to move files. I'll upload the display.xml when I have a chance.

[dulsi]

Here are the modified files for pocketchip. After applying this you need to copy your slot files and non-map tileset files from the 640x400 directory into the regular images directory. After doing this you play the game with the prototype UI. The game editor is broken with this change. I've been working on correcting that before releasing the files but have run into trouble. So I figure I'd give Methuselas (and others) what is available to give it a try.

(What is "directory" in wall.xml? If you have development binaries you don't need to move the images. However, the editor is still broken.)

EDIT: Bt Builder is now available in Fedora. I was finally approved as a packager.

[caars]

Here's a few observations from my current "messings around" with bt builder (I've been using 0.5.11 since dulsi released it)...

The left shift key no longer works (it hasn't worked at all since 0.5.11) - obviously I mean just when the game or editor is running (it works just fine everywhere else, and also when I fire up copies of 0.5.9 and earlier. I have no idea if it ever worked in 0.5.10 since that one never loaded on my system anyway). Naturally having to use R-Shift only is a bit annoying, but certainly not game breaking.

One thing Methuselas mentioned is having a "non-animating" version of his art available, and I've noticed a very good reason that'd be a good idea... when playing, bt builder apparently reloads the monster image every single time you enter in a command during combat. Normally this wouldn't be a problem, but some of the more involved animations actually create a noticeable delay as they load in. If the delay was just once at the start of the round that'd be one thing, but it happens every time you enter a combat command (again, only for monster images with involved animations - the stills don't have the problem). I don't know about you guys, but I'm quite used to the "command response" in combat being near instant (especially if you're just doing a quick 'aaaahdd' for simple fights that don't really require any spells or bard songs) - the picture load delay definitely 'breaks the flow'. Ultimately not having the monster picture reload after you enter each character command in combat is the best solution, but a bunch of non-animated choices is a good stopgap in the interim (and probably not bad if someone with a much lower end machine is trying to play around with bt builder).

Another request: I'd actually like an item type that can be set up like a potion - you can use the item without needing it to be equipped on the character. One solution would be to make it so that miscellaneous items don't require the item to be equipped for "use" to work (although any hit or other "on equip" type bonuses would still only be applied if the item was equipped). [And now that I've mentioned it, I'm actually wondering if a figurine type can "double" as a potion or an item that doesn't need to be equipped to be used? I'll give it a try next time I'm working on / testing my modules).

[dulsi]

How about a new release that fixes the left shift and doesn't reload the animation unless it changes? See web site.

The eventual plan is to cache some number of images so that if you fight X and then encounter X again it doesn't have to reload it. I haven't bothered implementing it yet.

Your item type request will need to wait for a later release.

This new version slightly xml files for setting up the screen. See the difference in label tag found in display.xml. It shouldn't matter to most people since they aren't editing those files but it does mean the pocketchip files I recently put up won't work without fixes. The goal of changing the xml file is to support multiple labels on the screen. This isn't needed for the game but the map editor could use a Label to display the current special on the square you are at, the current street on you the square you are at, and the current wall being placed.

[caars]

I did just want to check in with the following info:

The left-shift fix and the image loading change are working just wonderfully for me. So far almost all of my testing and playing around with my modules have only had bugs or errors crop up that are my own fault (i.e. the specials fire the way they're supposed to and only do bad stuff cause I accidentally told 'em to).

One bug that has been persistent (apologies for not reporting it earlier) - the non-combat version of "use item" works normally the first time, but after that complains that the character trying to use the item is not in combat (even if the item is set to cast a non-combat spell). For example, I have a one-use wineskin item that casts a one-turn spell that regenerates bard songs for one character. The first time I try to use the item outside of combat it works normally - and is consumed normally. Later, when I try to use another one that I have subsequently equipped it tells me I can't use the item because I'm not in combat. It *does* work normally in combat ... it just can't be used outside of combat any more.

I did try to see if figurines could be used without equipping them first - as I mentioned before, I'm looking for an item type that can be "used" (and consumed) without actually being equipped. No go. I suspect anything intended to cast a spell on "use item" must be equipped ... I do think there should be at least one class of item that can be "used" without being equipped first ... or possibly something that can be set to be "use without equip" in the item editor (e.g. add a parameter to "miscellaneous item" like "Can Only Use if Equipped" that can be set to yes or no on an item per item bases), either option accomplishes the same thing. If it's the former route, it doesn't really matter what type (since the item types in bt builder are actually pretty nebulous anyway - as near as I can tell its not like I couldn't classify all of my body armors as "helms" and all of my helms as armor ... or wands as miscellaneous items or whatever, since item 'type' doesn't appear to actually ever be displayed in game; if all of my body armors are wands with no charges or cast-able spells that happen to improve armor class I doubt the end user would ever know the difference, beyond wondering why they can't equip Plate Mail and a Wand of Awesome at the same time ... which I could easily rectify by making the Wand of Awesome armor with charges, a spell cast, and no change to AC).

[Methuselas]

I did try to see if figurines could be used without equipping them first - as I mentioned before, I'm looking for an item type that can be "used" (and consumed) without actually being equipped. No go. I suspect anything intended to cast a spell on "use item" must be equipped ... I do think there should be at least one class of item that can be "used" without being equipped first ... or possibly something that can be set to be "use without equip" in the item editor (e.g. add a parameter to "miscellaneous item" like "Can Only Use if Equipped" that can be set to yes or no on an item per item bases), either option accomplishes the same thing. If it's the former route, it doesn't really matter what type (since the item types in bt builder are actually pretty nebulous anyway - as near as I can tell its not like I couldn't classify all of my body armors as "helms" and all of my helms as armor ... or wands as miscellaneous items or whatever, since item 'type' doesn't appear to actually ever be displayed in game; if all of my body armors are wands with no charges or cast-able spells that happen to improve armor class I doubt the end user would ever know the difference, beyond wondering why they can't equip Plate Mail and a Wand of Awesome at the same time ... which I could easily rectify by making the Wand of Awesome armor with charges, a spell cast, and no change to AC).

Yeah....

Any item that has spell effects, must be equipped in order to use it - I found that out a while ago. BTBuilder has no reference to "type", when it comes to items, other than in the Item Editor. It's how I created lower and upper armors and cloaks, using the instrument and figurine types. Then, you run into a problem when you actually NEED to use said type for a specific item (ie, Instrument for Bards), so you end up with have and have not characters. Tis why I asked for an xml format that allowed us to create our own item types.

I've pretty much hit a brick wall with my module. Everything I want to do now is WAY beyond the scope of BTBuilder and in it's current form, impossible, so I've shelved the module indefinitely and went back to helping mod Rise from Eberus/Ashes of Eberus for Civ IV again. I doubt I'll be updating much concerning BTBuilder anymore.

[dulsi]

One bug that has been persistent (apologies for not reporting it earlier) - the non-combat version of "use item" works normally the first time, but after that complains that the character trying to use the item is not in combat (even if the item is set to cast a non-combat spell). For example, I have a one-use wineskin item that casts a one-turn spell that regenerates bard songs for one character. The first time I try to use the item outside of combat it works normally - and is consumed normally. Later, when I try to use another one that I have subsequently equipped it tells me I can't use the item because I'm not in combat. It *does* work normally in combat ... it just can't be used outside of combat any more.

I haven't been able to reproduce this. Do you have a module I can download and see the problem? I changed the torch to consumable and 1 time use. I created a new character and purchased two torches. He has no other equipment. I was able to use both items outside the shop.

I'll see about moving the item types to a file and allow you to configure if an item is usable when not equipped. The reason I haven't so far is that I really want a tree not a simple list. In Bard's Tale, you could find "sword" and then have to identify it. Ideally I'd like to use the item type for that purpose which means I need to have subtypes under hand weapon.

I've been reworking the UI code for Bt Builder. In the next release it will be possible to enable the pocket chip UI. I also discovered Fedora has improved the cross-compiling tools. Which means I might be able to compile SDL_ttf for windows. If I can, I may enable that as well.

[caars]

I haven't been able to reproduce this. Do you have a module I can download and see the problem? I changed the torch to consumable and 1 time use. I created a new character and purchased two torches. He has no other equipment. I was able to use both items outside the shop.

I'll see about moving the item types to a file and allow you to configure if an item is usable when not equipped. The reason I haven't so far is that I really want a tree not a simple list. In Bard's Tale, you could find "sword" and then have to identify it. Ideally I'd like to use the item type for that purpose which means I need to have subtypes under hand weapon.

I've been reworking the UI code for Bt Builder. In the next release it will be possible to enable the pocket chip UI. I also discovered Fedora has improved the cross-compiling tools. Which means I might be able to compile SDL_ttf for windows. If I can, I may enable that as well.

Hmmm ... *of course* now I can't replicate the problem either. I wanted to set it up so that all you had to do is load up the module's save file and use the item to see the problem ... but it's been working normally. I'll keep a watch for the bugged behavior and save immediately when I see it (and verify the save file when loaded still shows the error). I'll then send it your way... hopefully I'll see it again while playtesting in the next day or two (or three).

[dulsi]

Hmmm ... *of course* now I can't replicate the problem either. I wanted to set it up so that all you had to do is load up the module's save file and use the item to see the problem ... but it's been working normally. I'll keep a watch for the bugged behavior and save immediately when I see it (and verify the save file when loaded still shows the error). I'll then send it your way... hopefully I'll see it again while playtesting in the next day or two (or three).

I suspect a save file won't show the issue. I expect it to be something like you need to use the item, do one or more other things (like enter a fight or maybe use an item in a fight), and then try to use the item again.

I've got an itemtype.xml file working. The only additional option is gives you is "mustEquip". Some spots are still special. So hand weapon is the second spot. Instrument is the sixth. Same with bow, arrow, and thrown weapon spots.

I wrote a new open game source article about changes coming to Bt Builder.

[dulsi]

I've pretty much hit a brick wall with my module. Everything I want to do now is WAY beyond the scope of BTBuilder and in it's current form, impossible, so I've shelved the module indefinitely and went back to helping mod Rise from Eberus/Ashes of Eberus for Civ IV again. I doubt I'll be updating much concerning BTBuilder anymore.

What? That can't be allowed to stand. New release is available. You have an item type xml file. Purchasing skills now support selecting between multiple available skills. It displays the skill name not the job of the character. Is that enough to entice you back.

Bt Builder 0.5.13 released. Modify the map editor to display street names. Make the text area only popup when needed. Support a PocketCHIP display mode. Move item types to a file. Allow you to specify that some types can be used without being equipped. Make displaying charges configurable. Make to hit bonus of weapons only apply when using that weapon. Allow you to skill what skill to advance.

[caars]

I've had time to look over the item file - looks pretty straightforward, but I haven't yet designed a "potion" category (use without equip). Should have some time to work some more on my modules later this week.

A few things I've noticed recently...

1. When creating a new map, it prompts you for the filename you want. I'm embarrassed to admit that it took me a while to figure this out, but apparently you have to make sure the name you give it actually includes the .xml extension or the editor won't "see" the map file once you've created it. I just figured if I entered "filename" it would save it as "filename".xml, not just "filename." It's literally been so long since I manually had to include the extension in the filename I'd forgotten that's even a thing...

2. Definitely a few times where I was wishing there was a "copy map" feature, similar to the "copy special" feature available when placing specials.

3. Not something new, but I figured I'd complain about it since dulsi is doing such a great job of making little fixes here and there: if you set the number of items per character to higher than 8, it just writes the item list right down through the mage class spell level list at the bottom of the page. Seems like that should work using some sort of page up / page down feature... (Basically my modules always use 8 items just to avoid that, even though I'd use a higher number if I could).

For the future:

Probably useful to include a way to modify what the attribute bonuses actually affect. For what it's worth, I *think* this is what their current settings cover:

Str: Melee damage (but not hit). Not sure if it affects ranged damage or thrown damage.

Dex: AC, thief skill improvement per level, and hunter crit improvement per level.

Con: hp per level (including starting hit points).

Int: spell points per level (including starting spell points).

Luck: the saving throw? Not sure...

Out of curiosity, am I missing anything?