The Adventurers' Guild

I have trouble with both Greater Demons and Demon Lords, because yeah, a lot of the time they cast useless spells and waste their round. I think it's them casting a greater summoning spell, which is useless in the special slot because that slot is already taken by themself.

Which is another reason why Mangar makes a wimpy ally. His Wind Giant and Greater Summoning spells are both useless when he's on my team.

I have found, in the MSDOS version at least, that characters in the special slot never do their 4th attack. So my Demon Lord, which should have an awesome 72d4 breath weapon attack, never uses it. So he has a 2/3 chance of clawing and stoning an opponent, or 1/3 chance of casting the useless Greater Summoning spell. No wonder I look for a better special!

I don't ever remember having my Red Dragon disbelieved. In 100 battles, he slashed 65 times and breathed 35 times. That's a better kill count than any other special I have analyzed.

Although, I do like a Thor. I can easily get the Thor figurine, and he has LO armor class and lots of hit points, and does tons of damage. Which, like I say, is irrelevant because he always hits first and criticals on every attack.

It looks like the Black Dragon would be a little bit better than the Red Dragon, but as I look at the stats, I'm thinking the Soul Sucker would be the way to go! And I happen to know where to find one. I think I'll pop down there and bind him in, and see what it's like having one on my side.

I just have to say how much I like my pet Soul Sucker.

He is the Awesomest!

Really.

GRSU in the Apple IIe version also summonst a demon lord about half the time. I also have always gone with the wind dragon. It's almost never disbelieved (I think I've seen it happen once or twice), and about 1/3 of the time it breathes for a fair amount of damage. The rest of the time it hits, almost always first, for a fair amount of damage that kills a lot of enemies you'll face. It's not as much as the wind giant, but it's good enough and the intermittent breath weapon makes it worthwhile.

I used to do a lot of experience point farming with the 99x4 berserkers in the castle's 3rd floor. Always used a wind dragon, because 1/3 of the time, the dragon would breathe first and take out almost all of one of the 4 groups right away. MIBL times two would nail most of the remainder, plus a good percentage of the remaining berserkers. This meant the combat takes almost half as long -- the most problematic thing about using the berserker encounter to build up levels is that each fight takes a long time. I have seen that berserker fight end in 2 rounds, if the wind dragon happened to breathe each time.

Never occurred to me to try a soul sucker. He always breathes and does a lot more damage than the wind dragon, doesn't he?

Marco.

Well, the Soul Sucker breathes about as often as the Wind Dragon -- about 1/3 of the time. But he does quite a bit more damage. And he can't be disbelieved.

Yeah, I'm liking my pet.

Maven wrote:Well, the Soul Sucker breathes about as often as the Wind Dragon -- about 1/3 of the time. But he does quite a bit more damage. And he can't be disbelieved.

Yeah, I'm liking my pet.

Problem is, you have to go fetch him every game. Either in the 2nd level of the Catacombs or the 2nd level of Mangar's Tower. At least you can teleport to both of those levels.

Marco.

Certainly not the post powerful character, but the coolest special slot creature in my opinion is Mangar himself.It is possible, a powerful magic user can cast Mind Grab (or whatever) and it can work on Mangar, on the C64 tape version at least.

Here is my BT1 party (no cheating was involved in this party, just years of playing!)

Way back in the day I used to use a Demon Lord for the special slot once I got high enough level. This was the MS-DOS version, and he did use his breath weapon once in a blue moon, but it was incredibly rare. But yeah, he spent about half the time uselessly trying to summon friends.

Last time I played through I kept the WIDR right up until Mangar's tower, and I don't recall him ever getting disbelieved. But I switched him out for Thor once I got the figurine, and I have to say Thor is by far the best summon monster for the last couple of levels.

Oh, and once upon a time I did bind Mangar into my party, and won that way. I used the Spectre Snare on him, in fact. Then got a laugh at Kylearan proclaiming I'd defeated him while Mangar is sitting right there on the screen in my party.

I've never actually tried using Thor. I was always happy with my wind dragon. What does Thor do, anyway?

Marco.

Marco wrote:What does Thor do, anyway?

Low AC, incredibly tough, critically hits and virtually never misses. IIRC he doesn't have a breath weapon, but otherwise he's pretty much a guaranteed one-enemy-kill per round – which is arguably more valuable at the top of the tower when you have individual nasties like Vampire Lords and Greater Demons coming at you.